Mark This! Episode 33: Rafting is Calling
Stephen Smith, GM Scenic Safaris/Mad River in Wyoming, Aramark Destinations
Roger Wilson, General Manager, Adventures on the Gorge in West Virginia, Aramark Destinations
Jenny Adkins, Rover Operations Manager, Wilderness River Adventures in Arizona, Aramark Destinations
It is time to Mark This!, a podcast in which we peel back the corporate curtain to reveal the cool and innovative people, programs, and projects that are happening all over Aramark's varied lines of business. I'm Heather Dotchel. As a member of Aramark's Communications Team, I see and hear amazing things that are happening across our company every day.
These remarkable initiatives happen because we have remarkable people behind them, building opportunity, building innovation, and building community. Nations Vacation by Aramark is a collection of activities, experiences, and places to stay within some of America's greatest national parks and protected lands. Our mission is to inspire unforgettable and authentic experiences that reflect the culture that surrounds these once-in-a-lifetime places.
We are about to explore, embark, if you will, on an epic American pastime, whitewater rafting. Joining us today are representatives from three of our rafting adventures, Mad River in Wyoming, Adventures on the Gorge in West Virginia, and Wilderness River Adventures in Arizona. Welcome to our adventurers, Steve Smith, Roger Wilson, and Jenny Adkins. Let's learn a bit more about them. Steve, which whitewater adventure do you represent and what's your connection to it?
I am Steve Smith with Mad River out of Jackson Hole, Wyoming. I've lived in Jackson Hole for about 20 years, on and off, and love what I do. Mad River has been around since approximately 1977. I joined the team last year and has really taken off last year and we had a great season, and this beginning of this season looks fantastic as well. So really excited to get it going again this year.
Awesome. Roger, you are the general manager for Adventures on the Gorge. How did you come into this position?
My name is Roger Wilson. I'm the general manager here at Adventures on the Gorge. I've been associated with the company since 1975. We work on a new river primarily and another river called the Gauley River. We're extremely excited for the upcoming season.
All right. And Jenny, what do you do and what was your path there?
Hi, there. My name is Jenny Adkins. I am the operational manager of Wilderness River Adventures in Page, Arizona, and we provide whitewater rafting through the Grand Canyon. It is one of the most spectacular adventures, honestly, that you could ever go on. And for myself, I always want to provide a safe, fun environment for my amazing crew and for our guests. And Grand Canyon, it's truly grand. The first time that I got to go down Grand Canyon, I felt so lucky, and now I get to share it with those that are adventure enough to join me.
That sounds amazing. So the first thing we're going to do is a round-robin to get an overview of each of these exhilarating experiences that you're a part of. Steve, what makes your whitewater rafting trip unique for guests?
Ours is affiliated, so what's really cool about ours is we're based out of Jackson Hole, Wyoming. Our trips go down through the Brigadier National Forest, but we border Grand Teton National Park and Yellowstone National Park. We are surrounded by just millions of acres of wilderness. And on our whitewater trips, not only do you get the rapids and the excitement of that, but you could see a grizzly bear on the banks at times.
You can see moose on the banks getting a drink of water. It's really cool, so bald eagles. The wildlife is incredible on top of all that. So I think from a unique standpoint, there's not everywhere you're going to see a grizzly bear on the banks getting a drink of water while you're whitewater rafting. So it's really cool.
That's great. I grew up in Northern Vermont and my husband used to say, "Ah, I want to see a moose," and I'd be like, "I'm not sure you do when you get up close like that." And then he did and he finally got it. Roger, tell us about your unique whitewater experience.
Well, the New River Gorge National Park and Preserve is the center of our attraction here. Our river runs right in the middle of it. The river is very, very unique. It's very, very old. The river is also segmented into three sections and the sections work out perfectly. Very small rapids, medium rapids, and large rapids, so we can put the customer in the spot that they desire. And it's extremely beautiful.
And Jenny, your turn, what sets your whitewater rafting apart?
Grand Canyon, like I said, is very grand.
Yeah, just a tiny little crack on the Earth's surface here. We have a unique rating scale actually for our rapids due to the release of water from Lake Powell through Glen Canyon Dam. But we actually rate our rapids on a scale of one to 10, which if anybody's ever done any whitewater rafting, they hear 10 and it makes them nervous and also excited. But just the levels of the water in Grand Canyon can definitely change the rating of those rapids for not only our 18-foot oar boats, but the 37-foot outboard pontoon boats that we take through the Grand Canyon.
So I always find that really exciting. Being one of the Seven Wonders of the World is always an exciting tag that we get to put on there. But I think one of the most amazing unique parts about doing a trip in Grand Canyon, not only the incredible white water and the waterfalls and also the wildlife, but the different campsites every night that you get to stay at.
I think the favorite part of my job is we leave Lees Ferry at mile one and we exit at mile 187 and we always say it's an adventure. We don't have a planned place to hike, to eat lunch, where we're going to camp. So it's always exciting for not only the guests, but for the guides as well. Just it's always a wow and awe experience every day.
Oh, that is incredible. I don't know if my control freak self could handle not having a plan.
It's funny that you mentioned that. I think one of the most beautiful parts about watching people on a multi-day trip is by day two or three you can almost see this physical weight lifting off people's shoulders. I think you just finally have to be submissive to the area that you're in. And I think the beauty of that really shows on the last day of the trip when people are expressing not wanting to leave the canyon and not wanting to get back to the rim or the real world, I call it, back to technology. So a couple days in and you'll allow yourself to do that.
Well, let me follow up with that, Jenny, which is something I wanted to talk to you a little later about, but what are some of the favorite moments for your rafting guests? Do you have a story or two you can share?
Sure. Honestly, if it's somebody who has never been whitewater rafting, I would say the first notable rapid that we go through in Grand Canyon and the look on their faces, they look back whether you're rowing a boat or you're driving the boat, and the question is, how many more of these do we have? And you get to throw this giant number out over the days that you're there.
So definitely notable rapids, and then the waterfalls. I mean, anything from 20 feet to 100 feet right off the side of the riverbank as you're cruising down the river and getting the opportunity to wade in those or be in them is really amazing. I always use the line, you kind of learn how to live within your own skin again once you leave the rim world and you get to go down into the canyon.
Yeah, that's going to have to go on my bucket list. Steve, what are some of the favorite moments for your rafting guides?
The rafting guides, ooh, that's a tough question. I have a very experienced rafting guide. I would say out of everybody in the area, our raft guides are some of the most well versed and experienced guides. I have guides that are in their 40s and 50 year olds. I mean, they've been doing this for 20 or 30 years. So I would have to say they love the rapids as well. We have a big rapid right at the end of our session.
It's called Lunch Counter, and that's probably the one they really enjoy the most. There's actually companies there that will take your picture, which is really cool. And they take your pictures of all the boats and send them in so that people can purchase their pictures at the end of the trip. And they're back in Jackson. They have an office there, which is really cool.
And that business actually started years ago with Carrier Pigeons, believe it or not. And they used to send the film upriver to Jackson and have it developed and ready for people by the time they got back. There's a website you can go into the National Forest Service and see a short documentary on that. It's really cool. But yeah, I think that big rapid right at the end with the photographers there, it really, really gets a thrill out of everybody and their reactions and stuff.
Roger, you mentioned that New River is really old. I believe it's one of the oldest rivers on Earth, I was told. Tell us about the river itself, if you can, a little more detail.
Okay. The New River, there's always a little... The geologists are always warring with each other for which river is the oldest river in the world. And the New River goes from the oldest to the third oldest in the world. Like its counterparts of the old river, it flows north. It starts in North Carolina and ends in West Virginia. It's etched its way through an amazingly dense type of sandstone, and it's extremely... The riverbed itself and the way it presents itself when you're rafting, it's very, very unique.
Some house-sized boulders litter the sides of the river. It's a pool and drop river, meaning you have a nice pool. A little bit like the Grand Canyon, you have a nice pool, then you have a nice big rapid, and another nice pool, and swift currents that go between. It's incredibly beautiful. And factoring that it also flows through a temperate rainforest adds to the drama of it. It's rather unique, rather beautiful. We like to call it the Grand Canyon of the East.
All right, superb. Jenny, what are some of the challenges that the Grand Canyon faces?
I would say one of the biggest challenges that we face would be the information that is given about the water levels in the Lake Powell area and also pertaining to Grand Canyon. And we are definitely in a place where we should be talking about water conservation. Absolutely. And our water levels are lower, but it seems that there might be some misinformation on how much water we have.
I've been asked questions before if Lake Powell has more water or if the lake is still dry. And I just want everybody out there to know that there is a lot of water in the Colorado River, and that Lake Powell is just a portion of that Colorado River with the dams being in place to push more water into these pools and into these side canyons to be able to provide the adventures we do on the lake and in the canyon.
But all activities are open. Lake Powell is open. Grand Canyon is open. And so I just want to encourage anybody that might be considering not going on a river trip or not coming to Lake Powell or Lake Mead because of the water levels, we're rocking and rolling. We're ready to go for the season. So come and join us.
Roger, what are some of the other considerations or challenges that future rafters should take into place when planning their adventure?
One thing that people might want to consider is the time of year and the water levels. I mean, the water temperatures. In the spring, water's high and the water's cold. Typically, at one of our spring trips, the river could be 38 degrees water temperature. But when you come in mid-summer, that same river section is lower and the temperature in the mid-80s.
It's like bath water. And then as fall comes, the water will drop down in the 60s. So just the quality of your vacation and do you mind cold water or do you want bath water? So it's just something to think about when you're planning your vacation, especially for the kids.
Steve, what's a challenge you face as a whitewater rafting outfitter?
Weather is the biggest issue we deal with. Springtime, especially being in the mountains here, we have huge snowfalls. And in the spring, our water levels get really pretty extreme, like early June. To give you an example, I mean, at the end of our season, our CFS, which is cubic feet per second, that goes through is about 3,000. And then in the springtime, that goes up to 20 to 25,000. So it gets pretty extreme. We have problems then taking little kids and stuff on those type of trips.
So there's some age restrictions, and we take every safety precaution there is. We do wear helmets at that time. And like I say, we monitor the ages and stuff. So definitely weather. I've lived in Jackson, like I said, for over 20 years, and I have seen it snow every month of the year I've been here, including July and August. So it's not normal, but it can happen. So it's really hard to sell a whitewater trip when it's snowing outside.
Well, that would certainly be unique, not an experience most people would have.
We still go. Trust me. We're still out there going. We provide wetsuits for everybody, so it still goes on, but you don't get a lot of walk-ins on those days.
Jenny, can you tell me a little bit more about your guides and their experience in the Grand Canyon?
We have a long-standing guide pool at Wilderness. A lot like Steve, some of these guides have been working here for 20 to 31 years. And I would say something that makes them amazing is they're fun, they're safe. Everybody has their different ways of entertaining. Some people love to play music. Some people love to read poems. Some people like to tell stories. And I would say the most exciting part about all of them is it doesn't matter how long you've been a guide.
You get up to some of these incredible whitewater rapids. And I've asked some of them, I'm 13 years in the game right now and asking 20 to 31-year-old veterans, I say, "Does your heart still pound before you go into Hans or Crystal or Lava Falls?" And every one of them says, "Yes. And the day it stopped, it's time for me to retire. The day I think that I've got this river and I've got this under control is the day that I probably need to go home."
Because I'll tell you, the first guy that ever says, "Oh yeah, I've done this so many times and I'm going to be fine. And I'm going to," as they say," slick it," boy, I'm telling you, that river can hear you. There's something every single time that happens. So just the camaraderie. And one thing that we have at Wilderness that we even hear from some of the other companies that run through Grand Canyon is we really are a big family.
Everybody has been together for so long. We don't only spend time in Grand Canyon, but we travel together off seas. We ski. We travel out of the country. We get together for big barbecues or camp out. So there's something really special about getting the opportunity to be with your family that often in such an incredible place.
As always, with Aramark, we come back to the people time and time again. Roger, I'm going to toss to you for a closer. What is your best elevator pitch to convince somebody to try rafting?
Rafting is a way to see places that you'll never see from an airplane because you have to fly too high. You can't see them from a car because you can't see these unique features. It's a way to get away from your normal world. It's a way to become one with nature. And you can pick how close to nature and what is your risk level to the quality of whitewater that's for you.
And whether you're on the New River or you're on the Grand Canyon, or whether you're on the Snake River, Mad River, there are places that we can all go rafting in this country and go with our companies just to warm your heart. When that first wave smacks you in the face, it's nothing like it.
Okay, so I lied, that's not my closer. I actually have a question for each one of you. Do any of you have an estimated idea of how many times you've rafted down a river?
I actually know my exact number. Is that cheesy?
I have 97 trips through Grand Canyon.
I have probably 200 through Glen Canyon on just the upper stretch there from the dam down to Lees Ferry, which is a really beautiful stretch of water as well for 15 miles. Maybe even more than 200. But yeah, I'm working on that 100 and I can't stop until I get there.
Oh, perfect. Steve, Roger, how about either of you? Any idea?
Well, I'm nowhere near Jenny. I get stuck in the office too much to get out there, but I do. I've probably been down the river closer to 50 times probably or more in various forms.
Roger, any estimate from you?
I hate to say it, but 50 years of rafting.
That's a lot of river trips.
Yeah, I'm afraid I'm over the thousand mark.
More like 1,200 I would think.
Wow! My number is one in case anybody was interested. Once on a teeny, tiny, little, barely qualified as whitewater. But yeah, my whole family went on the raft and we didn't sink, so I called it a win. Want to know more about our rafting adventures? Visit our Newsroom on Aramark.com to access more information. Steve, Roger, and Jenny, thank you for being here. And to our Mark This! listeners, thanks to you most of all.
